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judgement of the committee in these matters. I think when they said there is too much Government interference, too much Government subsidy, they were talking about many other areas which at the Senator's convenience I could enumerate.

Senator CANNON. That is why I am asking. Does the Senator feel that if there is Government interference in this area and Government subsidy, that it should be continued? Is that the essence of it?

Senator MURPHY. I believe it should be continued. It is the reflection of the united feeling of the civic leaders of the community organizations that this service is badly needed. What happens, gentlemen, is that you have a transcontinental airline that goes from one point to another and there it stops. From this point on in those areas which are spread out, this is really a continuation of the air service that is needed badly, because the only way you can get from San Francisco Airport to Berkeley, otherwise, is a long circuitous route which will take you an hour and 10 minutes during a period of good traffic, and during the bad time it will take you up to 3 hours to make the trip, whereas you can take the helicopter across the bay and I think it is a matter of 11 or 12 minutes. 

The same thing is true in Los Angeles. Literally hundreds of thousands of people who to to Disneyland, for instance, many of them take the helicopter directly from the airport down to the airport which has been provided at Disneyland. Orange County and all these areas are growing tremendously in numbers of people and industry. It would be very unfortunate if this service were to be discontinued. 

Senator CANNON. I thank the Chairman.

Senator MONRONEY. Thank you very much, Senator.

It is the Chairman's understanding that the San Francisco operation is subsidized partly by private industry; by the airlines, for example.

Senator MURPHY. That is my understanding, yes, sir.

Senator MONRONEY. This makes it possible for them to operate. The fact that they were willing to help subsidize this type of operation led the committee to call hearings at this point so that we could determine whether there would be a chance of keeping this industry alive.

As the distinguished Senator from Nevada knows, because he participated in helping save it last year when it was ordered to be terminated by the House, and unfortunately the Senate didn't give much support, unless some funds are coming from outside Government, it is likely that the entire helicopter air carrier industry could be eliminated. I do not see how any of the present four helicopter carriers can continue without financial support from Government or industry. Yet the order, the strong order by the Congress of last year, was that the