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RAPHAEL SOYER        -5-      INTERVIEW: 9/3/69

RS: shows no aloofness and no objectivity. But I admire, say the work of Velazquez. I admire the work of, say Degas. Because they did not -- their work was a little bit less self-revealing. They had a certain aloof quality. Of course, they did reveal themselves in their work, but their sympathies or their likings -- their likes were not as evident in their work as mine -- as in mine. For instance, in mine people always talk about sympathy that I show for people. Well, I think maybe that's a weakness in my work.

SR: Well, I'd like -- I wonder why you feel that way.

RS: Well, as I said, because I prefer work that has more aloof and more objective, rather than subjective. I prefer that kind of work.

SR: So this must leave you with a feeling of frustration then.

RS: I have, what you call it, resigned myself to this. That's me, and I can't help it.
LEA: Well what is there that subjectively expresses itself in your pictures, in the paintings that you do -- that distresses you.

RS: Well, for instance...well, I wouldn't say "distresses" me. I wouldn't use this particular --

LEA: That's too strong a word?

RS: -- term. Yes. I mean, I prefer work which are more objective, more impersonal, you see. I like the work say of what's his name, Vermeer. There's no -- it's a kind of a very almost abstract quality. I mean, without -- you don't know what the author, what the artist felt about the people that he portrayed, that he painted. They're very beautiful and very aloof, very abstract in a sense.