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before KUP had only 2 impig very small clay oven, made himself no cost does in kitchen, no [[underline]] special [[/underline]] place no other bank loans -capital before from selling wood (but not a ped. kayne)- he had 2 trees, cut down has borrowed from kids, but only 2000 - 3000 at a time 1. [[slash through]] A [[/slash through]] mantu sells tires in tasik, 1 is a kernet truck 4 married children give him + wife 8000 - 10,000 sumbangan a mo he gives no more than 1000 to grandchildren