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292 HELICOPTER AIR SERVICE PROGRAM Senator MONRONEY. Your down time was as high as 10 percent wasn't it, because of weather conditions? Mr. CUMMINGS. Sir, in that particular month, we were down 34 percent, that was the month of December. Historically the record is, because of weather, about 15 percent. Somewhere in that vicinity. This is the worst record, of which we are not a bit proud, in the airline industry, in this country or I suspect in any country in the world. But it is a problem which we recognized in 1952, knowing at that time that it could not be solved until we had aircraft with the capability of flying with one engine having failed. We only received such an aircraft, again after considerable effort, in 1962. The intervening years, however, we not wasted. They involved a tremendous amount of work, the investment of a lot of capital. And today we are confronted, having gotten the official piece of paper, the certificate of authorization from the Federal Aviation Agency, we are confronted with an investment of $70,000 per aircraft for the installation of the necessary flight equipment, and with an investment approaching a quarter of a million dollars in training expenses. We don't know precisely how much training is going to be involved. To an extent it will vary with the proficiency of the pilot. But it will be quite a lot of hours, somewhere between 12 and 10 hours per pilot flying under the hood in simulated instrument conditions before we will be able to inaugurate schedules under instrument flight conditions and take the economic advantage that I have described. Senator MONRONEY. The beams are in now for the New York area, are they not? Mr. CUMMINGS. Excuse me. Senator MONRONEY. The air traffic control systems are in now for the helicopters for the New York area, are they not? Mr. CUMMINGS. We have four stations in connection with Decca installed in the New York are, yes. Senator MONRONEY. Have they been installed in Chicago and Los Angeles, or San Francisco, where they also have helicopter schedules? Mr. CUMMINGS. No, sir, they are not. Those carriers don't have the same degree of weather problem that we do. Senator MONRONEY. California, excepting for smog, and I guess they can get through that, will not have it. San Francisco might have some fog problems since they operate across the bay. I don't know what their problem is. They will testify later. Chicago will undoubtedly have considerable fog problems. I wonder if the cost if prohibitive for an expectation of early development of instrument landing systems for these airports as well. Mr. CUMMINGS. I can't speak for the other carriers. I have quite enough problems of my own. I know that in my case it is more than worth the capital, and that the capital investment over the 14 years that we have made will be recaptured in just 2 or 3 years, just from the fact that our revenues will be improved that much and our operating efficiency. Senator MONRONEY. It is not true that as of now, and I repeat, "as of now," that the vertical aircraft are the only types that hold promise of zero weather landing capability? Mr. CUMMINGS. I am not qualified to answer that. We have the capability.