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206        HELICOPTER AIR SERVICE PROGRAM

and the rooftop, and now the Washington situation, and then some others—is because each of these has represented a major effort on our part to help ourselves to reduce our costs and to increase our revenues. 

We were instrumental, amongst others, in instigating a hearing before the Civil Aeronautics Board directed at establishing helicopter service in the Washington-Baltimore area 3 or 4 years ago. At that time, as Mr. Boyd said Monday, the Board determined that the economics weren't sound. We then more recently went to the FHHA, Mr. Weaver, and carried through to a point whereby we were going to conduct an operation for the solution of a mass transportation problem.

We would still like to do this, because we believe it should be done, that there is a major and beautiful airport, 29 miles about, from here that would be much more useful because the flight time from just about here is about 101/2 minutes. 

Senator MONRONEY. It would be useful, may I say, if the fare between Dulles and downtown could be made attractive. I think it is about $15 and $18 cab fare in from there, and I think if the choppers could make the fare $10 to the downtown area, for example, from some place on the Mall, around maybe the Ellipse, near where the President's heliport is, at the rear of the White House, just across from where you have the playing fields, that there might be enough space to utilize it as a heliport.

Certainly it would be a very satisfactory way of getting to and from the three airports to be served—two airports at the moment. 

Mr. CUMMINGS. In collaboration with the Sikorsky Division of United Aircraft, we did make a proposal to the FHHA. We haven't pushed it because we were getting into problems which we are here to discuss with you right now. We were told that it didn't have much chance under the present circumstances, which is understandable.

Senator MONRONEY. We have reached this point today, however, where the service to Washington, perhaps the service to Atlanta, and maybe the service to Miami and possibly service to one or two other places, becomes vital to selling the practical political problem of getting the funds passed by the House. Houston might be one place, where, with their new airport, they might need this.

For that reason it is not the question of objection, if you have followed these, and I am sure you have, it is not the question of the objection to the desirability or practicability of helicopter service, but the lack of having enough helicopter service to go around. Therefore, we should end this great experiment that for some 14 or 15 years has been giving us knowledge in VTOL aircraft.

Mr. CUMMINGS. I thoroughly agree with you. That was the purpose of our recent efforts with the FHHA.

Senator MONRONEY. Housing and Home Financing Agency?

Mr. CUMMINGS. Yes.

That was the exact objective of that effort. In that connection, how would we pay for it? We had talked and had considered and had proposed a fare of $10 each way. We had assumed that we would enter into arrangements with the carriers serving this area who would want to serve Dulles under these circumstances whereby they were having troubles getting passengers to go way out there or come way in from there, or landing at Friendship as you indicated you had, and finding your car at Dulles and this sort of thing.