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HELICOPTER AIR SERVICE PROGRAM     337

Mr. HALABY. He is quite familiar with the testimony. 

Senator MONRONEY. "Was he here during the hearings," was the question I asked.

Mr. HALABY. Mr. Ward Masden, of our Flight Standards Service. 

Mr. MASDEN. Mr. Chairman, I was not here yesterday. 

Senator MONRONEY. Why weren't you here for the hearing? Do we have to send a subpena [[ subpoena]] to get the man in charge of helicopters for the Federal Aviation Act down here? It seems to me that common interest would have drawn him and made him wish to be here, because this is a new frontier we are talking about in aviation. 

Mr. HALABY. Mr. Masden has been on that frontier and is working very hard with these carriers as they will testify. He was here 2 of the 3 days of the hearing. The first day, and today. He was not here yesterday, sir. Other FAA representatives were here. They have informed him and me of the testimony. 

At this time we have no application. If we got an application we would probably have to give it a negative reply on the grounds that they are operating single-engine helicopters in a very densely populated area. 

The policy and the rule from the beginning has been that you must be able to operate a single-engine helicopter over the route intended, and at all times make a safe autorotation without excessively endangering those on the ground. 

Senator MONRONEY. You operated single-motor equipment into the Federal Building, which has been flown over, and is extremely congested, within the Loop, for years. Suddenly we find now that this is not the case. Why were these rules changed?

If it was safe then, certainly it is more safe now because you are not landing on a building. You are landing in a park which is as big as all outdoors. 

Mr. HALABY. Sir, those flights were authorized in a different era for mail, as I understand. They were not passenger carrying flights. 

Senator MONRONEY. They are equally dangerous or safe to the traffic underneath, whether they carry mail or whether they are carrying passengers. 

Mr. HALABY. Yes, sir. I am quite sympathetic with your objective in having a close-in heliport to the midmetropolitan area of Chicago, Senator. So far Meigs Field has been designated by the authorities and the carriers there. It is very close in, but not close enough.

Senator MONRONEY. $1.50 taxi ride, it was testified yesterday.

Mr. HALABY. Yes, sir.

Senator MONRONEY. That is enough to keep a man, if he goes $1.50 on a cab, to go another $1.50 and get out there on the cab in spite of the loss of time, because you lose time going from the Loop to Meigs Field. You have already sacrificed that time. 

What your Helicopter Department of the FAA has handed is an impossible package. As far as a substantial amount of traffic it is the lowest generated downtown to airport traffic that we have. If we are interested in promoting aviation, I think we should be interested in promoting downtown heliports.

I was amazed and shocked to find out that if you want to go to O'Hare from the Loop you have to drive in a reverse direction all the way and go out and fight the traffic across that Michigan Avenue complex