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I would also like to state that last year for the first time in many years a boat company decided to operate between Washington and Bermuda and from the information I have it was quite successful. Certainly that is an indication of the amount of business that would be available, and I certainly can't help still having the enthusiasm that I have had throughout the years for colonial.
HR. SKOGLUND: I think it is perfectly wonderful, but I always came back to the fact that there is a capital outlay necessary to do the job.
MR. SILVER: It would be a complete major revision in our thinking certainly and by the same token I go along with you that there are two sides to every question.
THE CHAIRMAN:  You spoke of the loyalty of those employees. I would just like the put my stamp of verification on that. that is one thing that Colonial has an abundance of -- loyalty. I think that the result of that loyalty, one big result, is the fact we just celebrated our 25th Anniversary of safety. We have received many congratulatory messages from important people; The Governor of the State of New York, the Mayor of New York and so many people that I hesitate to try to name them. 
In that regard I think it would be appropriate to incorporate in the record of this meeting those congratulatory messages. In view of that I will entertain a motion that we do that. 
MR. SKOGLUND: I so move.
DR. MOSS: I second the motion.
THE CHAIRMAN: I assume there is no objection to that, so we will do that.
MR. KURLAND: May I ask a point of information? Do you have any idea what Eastern would do with Colonial equipment if they should acquire the assets of Colonial?
THE CHAIRMAN: I imagine ( and it is purely a conjecture on my part) that they will dispose of it. As you know, Colonial has five DC-3 equipment. Also, Colonial has five DS- 4s, and I understand that Eastern has been trying to sell their DC-4 equipment. So I assume that that Colonial equipment would be disposed of by Eastern.
MR. KURLAND: As long as you are on that assumption, it means that they have plenty of their own equipment available because they have that off-season business to contend with too. Therefore thay can switch a lot of their equipment over to the Montreal-New York run. By the same token that they leased that constellation on the New York-Bermuda run, why couldn't Colonial dispose of their equipment from either Eastern or National, or whatever airlines have that equipment available? 
What is the comparative figure in the overhead in running on a lease basis as opposed to buying new equipment? Is there much of a difference?
THE CHAIRMAN: Mainly because I don't think either National or Eastern at this time would have the equipment to operate Colonial routes.
MR. KURLAND: With the 140 planes that Eastern has, couldn't they switch eight over to National-New York business in the off-season?
THE CHAIRMAN: In the off-season, as far as Eastern operation is concerned, the seasonal aspect of that operation is becoming less and less every year from what they tell me. I don't have the figures on their traffic from year to year, but I understand that in the summer season Miami has picked up tremendously and Florida generally has picked up tremendously, and their season problem has diminished considerably.
I would say that if Eastern can't break a constellation loose to lease us on April first, that they are probably pretty tight on equipment. You have got to remember that Eastern also is operation a number of interchanges with other carriers where their equipment goes, for example, from Miami to Chicago and Northwest takes it and goes right on out to Seattle with it.
I believe Eastern is honest in their statement to me that they just can't spare an airplane at this time.
SECRETARY CAMERON: If I may present one comment on the matter of leasing planes and interchanges, you have to get the Civil Aeronautics Board approval on that. Now you lease one plane. The Board so far has been willing is an advance approval on it. But when you start to lease all or a substantial part and enter into operating contracts, that is under Section 408 of the Civil Aeronautics Act requiring a hearing, and interchanges are, also under Section 408, illegal until they are approved, and require hearings on that.
Generally speaking, interchange arrangements have taken just about as long as a merger case, in normal cases. There have been one or two cases where the subject matter was decided in advance where they were able to expedite. Continental had one that went through in a hurry, but normally many of them have taken a year or more from the time of the original filing to the time they got it done.
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