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hostility, I think. And it's this kind of thing which can, which I think forms or crystallizes into a kind of style which is very demanding, energetic, so forth, to me. And I think it has a lot to do with this point I was... was talking about: the conceptualization of art rather than the visual. Because conceptualization in a way means oversimplification, and...the...I'm concerned very much [[strikethrough]] whic [[no strikethrough]] with apparent oversimp...over-simplification. And...let me say that all over again just for the tape. I'm concerned with apparent over-simplification. And I think art maybe has been concerned with this for quite a while. I think that Mondrian is a...maybe looked at as being with this and Miro. I doesn't mean that the art is over-simplified; but it's a kind of stylistic development.

Ques: This really doesn't answer what I'm asking. Because for example when you do a Mondrian it's not the simplification that you're concerned with. You do something very strange to it.

Roy: Well, I think that it has...when I...say when I do a Mondrian or a Picasso, it has, I think, a sort of cheapening effect because I'm trying to make a commercialized Picasso or Mondrian or a commercialized abstract expressionist painting, let's say. At the same time I'm very much concerned with getting my own work to be a work of art, so that it has a sort of rebuilding aspect also to it. So it's, it's completely rearranged; it's become commercialized because the style that I switch it into is one of commercialization. At the same time, I recognize that this is only a mode or a style and it's not the truth of my own work because...